By Phil Hecken, with Mike Styczen
A few months back, I ran a weekend column on old-time ball parks, all of which are long gone now, and the reaction to it was very positive — and while ballparks themselves aren’t quite uni-related, there seems to be a similar passion amongst Uni Watchers for the old palaces, nostalgia-wise at least, as there is for uniforms.
I had wanted to do a followup (or three) for some time, actually planning today’s column with Mike Styczen since around the time the original ballpark column appeared. Well, today is that day, and I’m extremely pleased to have Mike pen what is a wonderful look back at the two “original” Canadian stadia (for their major league teams): Jarry Park (or Parc Jarry) for the Expos and Exhibition Stadium for the Blue Jays.
Before we get into Mike’s portion of this article, here’s a quick trivia question: “What was the first major league park to have a home run ball land in a swimming pool?” If you answered, The BOB Chase Field, you’d be wrong. That honor actually belongs to Montreal, where the Expos once played, and you can see the pool here.
Steeped in history and tradition, Jarry and Exhibition Stadium were both unique, and while no longer hosting major league baseball, they still bring back memories for those who had the privilege of watching the show in Canada. I love the old quirky parks, and while neither of these two is as old as those detailed in “Take Me Out To The Ballpark,” they still rank right up there in the “coolness” factor. So, without further ado, here’s Mike to bring us his tour of these two great Canadian venues.
Jarry & The Ex
By Mike Styczen
Writing about the Ex brought back a lot of memories – my dad took me to a lot of games there when I was a kid (seats were only a dollar) and later I went to a lot with my friends. To paraphrase Jean-Luc Picard, although Skydome was superior in every conceivable way to the Ex, it just wasn’t the same anymore.
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Jarry Park Stadium
Montreal of the 1960s was on a roll. Expo ’67 brought Montreal to international prominence, city was becoming more cosmopolitan, and in 1967 the city was awarded a National League team to begin play in 1969.
The only problem – there was no stadium suitable for major league baseball.
The Montreal Royals had played in Delorimier Stadium, which seated 20,000 but was built in 1928 and was (by that time) decrepit and unsuitable for the Expos. The team also considered the Autostade, which seated 33,000 but which was in a terrible location and would have required major renovations.
A site was selected in Jarry Park, a municipal park north of downtown. The stadium (actually called Jarry Park Stadium, but usually called Jarry Park) seated 3,000 at the time — this is basically the portion directly behind home plate. The stadium was quickly expanded to seat a little over 28,000 by the addition of a single deck of stands along the first base and third base sides and by the addition of a small section of bleachers in left field. The team had promised (as part of its expansion bid) that a new stadium would be ready by 1972, so Jarry Park was built with minimal amenities and features. There was a large electronic scoreboard in right field. The field was grass.
The only feature of any note was an outdoor municipal swimming pool about 100 feet past the right field fence. A few home run balls (including one by Willie Stargell) are said to have reached the pool.
The team played there from their 1969 inagural season until 1976 (a total of 8 seasons). After Montreal was awarded the 1976 summer Olympic games, construction started on the Olympic Stadium, and the team moved there in 1977 after it was converted from the Olympic setup to a convertible baseball/football setup.
In addition, in 1970, the stadium was used for some minor league games. That year, the Montreal Expos moved their AAA affiliate Buffalo Bisons to Winnipeg to play as the Winnipeg Whips, and had them play 18 home games in 13 days in Jarry Park when the Expos were out of town in June.
Jarry Park never hosted a playoff game.
After the Expos left, the stadium was used for other purposes, (including a Papal mass) was modified for tennis use, and eventually the 1969 additions were removed and new tennis stands constructed. The oldest portions of the stadium (the stands behind home plate) today form part of Stade Uniprix, which hosts Grand Prix tennis events every summer.
Exhibition Stadium
Exhibition Stadium was actually the fourth stadium on the grounds of the Canadian National Exhibition, west of downtown Toronto on the shore of Lake Ontario. Originally constructed for football, the roofed north grandstand seated 26,000 and was constructed in 1948. The stadium was completed with the construction of a small south grandstand in 1959. The stadium had a grass field and, in addition to being the home of the Toronto Argonauts hosted the Grey Cup nine times between 1959 and 1977.
By the mid-1970s, it seemed that Toronto was destined to be the next major league city. The city made pitches to lure the San Francisco Giants only to have the deal fall apart. Finally, in 1976 the American League voted to expand to Toronto for the 1977 season.
Exhibition Stadium (also known as CNE Stadium) was extensively renovated to accommodate the Blue Jays. The south (1959) grandstand was demolished, leaving the north (1948) grandstand intact. In place of the south grandstand, a roofless single-deck grandstand seating about 20,000 was built which stretched the entire length of the football field and then wrapped around the west endzone towards the north grandstand.
The first Blue Jays game was played at renovated Exhibition Stadium in April 1977, with snow covering the entire field. The field was astroturf for the entire life of the stadium.
Unlike most multipurpose stadiums, Exhibition Stadium had no moveable stands. This led to the unique layout where a significant number of seats down the first base line and in the grandstand were far beyond the outfield fence and faced towards the unused portion of the football field. This was a stadium with 20,000 good seats and 25,000 bad seats for baseball — it was estimated that the seats in the far end of the north grandstand were over 400 feet behind the centre field fence. It also meant that the stands were ridiculously far from the field for football.
There was a large scoreboard at the end of the football field, well behind the right field fence. The batter’s eye was an area about four sections wide and ten rows high covered with a black tarp.
Despite the strange layout, the Jays drew over two million to the Ex five times in their 12+ years there, including peak attendance of nearly 2.8 million in the infamous 1987 season. Attendance was helped greatly by the vast abundance of cheap seats — a local grocery store sold undated tickets to the north grandstand, which was entirely general admission, for half of face value (initially $1, later $2).
In addition to the Argos and Blue Jays, Exhibition Stadium hosted the NASL Toronto Blizzard and was used for numerous concerts over the years, with a capacity of up to 70,000 in its largest configuration.
Exhibition Stadium hosted one playoff series, the 1985 ALCS, won by the Kansas City Royals in 7 games.
Unlike Jarry Park, Exhibition Stadium wasn’t intended to be a temporary stadium. But as its faults became apparent (layout and weather in particular) both the Blue Jays and Argonauts began to plan for a domed stadium. After the 1982 Grey Cup was played in atrocious conditions, plans picked up steam, and in 1985 construction started on SkyDome. Both the Blue Jays and Argonauts moved to SkyDome in 1989.
Exhibition Stadium sat basically unused for 10 years until it was unceremoniously demolished in 1999. The site was used for CNE parking and for midway rides until 2005 when BMO Field was built on roughly the same site to house Toronto FC.
Thanks so much for that piece Mike. Interestingly, when I asked Mike to write that, I had no idea it would run today (nor did he), but we both wanted to add a little codacil to include something he penned last Father’s Day:
I’m one of those people who knows that Field of Dreams wasn’t about baseball, it was about fathers and sons. Ray and his father getting the opportunity to have one more catch in the field.
Ray Kinsella: Hey”¦ Dad? You wanna have a catch?
John Kinsella: I’d like that.My dad took me to my first major league baseball game. Jays versus Athletics, on Victoria Day, 1977. I don’t remember much about the game other than we were a long way from home plate, the seats were metal benches on the first base side, we were facing into the football stands and had to turn sideways to see the baseball field, and the Jays lost.
We went to dozens of games when I was a kid. In those days you could buy undated tickets for the grandstand at Exhibition Stadium for one dollar at the grocery store. Me and my dad could go to games for two bucks, it was cheaper than going to a movie.
We were together at the top of the fifth deck on the first base side at the Jose Canseco home run game in 1989.
He taught me to catch and throw in our front yard, and he coached all my little league teams until I got older and better and they insisted on having “real” coaches. He still spent hours playing catch with me, and came to every one of my games. Even when I was an adult and played slowpitch he still came to as many games as he could.
Our last game together was in the summer of 2004, Jays versus Devil Rays at Skydome. I don’t remember anything about the game other than Jorge Sosa pitched for the Rays and (not knowing anything about the Rays) he thought Sammy Sosa was pitching for about the first three innings.
He died four years ago of pancreatic cancer. I’ll think of him a lot today, and honour him by watching a little baseball and by having a catch with my son (who was born three weeks before my dad died) in the backyard.
Mike wrote that beautiful prose on Uni Watch. Today is Victoria Day in Canada. It’s also the 33rd anniversary of the first ballgame Mike ever saw.
Uni Watch News Ticker: Remember Dave Battafarano, who was designing his team’s throwback uniforms? The finished uniforms turned out great, as you can see in these photos. ”¦ Reprinted from Friday’s comments: Dig these amazing old Rams yearbook covers. ”¦ Longtime Uni Watch pal Jared Wheeler was paging through the latest Hunt Auctions catalog and came across some cool stuff, including a 1940s Cal Bears baseball uni with numbers on the pants; a spectacular 1950s college all-star football jersey; a beautiful 1950s American Legion baseball uni; and a 1920 Cal football jersey. ”¦ Interesting discussion regarding possible changes to the Wizards’ team name and/or colors (with thanks to Stephen Wong). ”¦ New Mexico State football will wear a helmet decal honoring the USS New Mexico this fall. ”¦ New logo for the Japanese baseball all-star game (with thanks to Jeremy Brahm). ”¦ Also from Jeremy: Very interesting crescent moon pattern on the Turkish national volleyball uniform. ”¦ Jeffrey Moulden writes, “I got this off the Fleer Sticker Project link. I am 99% sure that the stadium behind Johnny Bench in this photo is old Tampa Stadium. The first couple of years it was not enclosed and they didn’t build the second press box till the late 70’s or 80’s. Plus the Reds used the Tampa complex where the Yankees are as home base and spring training then I believe.” … Johnny Garfield has a FNOB alert, from 1986, on the Vikings’ Wade Wilson — who is punting in this paticular game. It can be seen @ 0:34 and at 0:44. … Check out this amazing trophy that was used in the Creighton vs Drake football rivalry back in the day (thanks to Patrick Zach.) “Absolutely beautiful.” … Jay Danborn found footage of the “11 Ugliest Domes” on Leafs Players. Says Jay, “Interesting cage Lanny McDonald sported. Also excellent show of cross sport equipment. Love the 1980’s tubular football neckroll. And lots of 1970’s football facemasks. Enjoy.” … Kirsten has found a great non-uni read, “A couple of local smokestacks of beauty.” … Peter Kurilecz notes this great site with English football club tabs across the top link to pages with uniforms and photos [*NOTE* that link was working as of Sunday evening, but seems not to be working now — apologies if it appears broken] … Something especially for Paul comes from Alexander Ozenberger, who writes, “I’m sure you can relate to this guy.” … UW tennis correspondent Brinke Gurthrie checks in from Roland Garros with some tennis news: Rather unobtrusive Geico Patch on Gisela Dulko; an interesting Roland Garros patch on the adidas kicks; Both Rafa Nadal and Roger Federer have special edition sneakers for the Open; and, for the first time ever, Nadal will wear a watch during competition — now, that’s not just any timepiece — it’s a custom RN Richard Mille watch, and it goes for $425,000 … Sean Patton has some thoughts on this years’ SEC Baseball Tournament Logo. “I really like it’s look, with the stadium and pennants. It’s very classic and a huge improvement from 2009. I’ve also attached the previous few years’ logos, none of which I really like, except 2008 isn’t bad. 2006 looks very generic as it doesn’t even have the year on it. Not sure if they used it for multiple years pre-2006 or not.” … Loyal reader Cosgrove Watt has a question. It’s at the end of this quote: “After entering a fake birthdate, watch the ad on the far right of the thumbnails at the bottom of the page. You’ve seen it a lot recently, it’s the one where they show different ways of carrying ten beers in some mythical ballpark where they let you buy more than two at a time. In the opening seconds, one guy gets up and all his friends ask him to bring them back a beer. Look at their ballcaps. Is that the logo of the Brooklyn Eagles?” … Eagle-eyed Justin Bates was watching the Cubs vs. Rangers game yesterday and noticed Cubs catcher Geovany Soto’s helmet decal appeared to be a bit askew. … Bizarre scene in KC yesterday, as Dexter Fowler lost his glove after slamming into the outfield wall trying to grab a long fly. Alex Higley was Johnny-on-the-spot to grab the aftermath when he reemerged from behind the wall after scaling it to retrieve his wayward glove … Brandon Davis notes that Kevin Kozmanoff is back to the old helmet decal style. … Here is a twitter link of an interesting tidbit concerning the other Nats #1 pick from ’09, Drew Storen, who picked up his first MLB hit in his first professional AB (thanks to Drew Storen) … Jeremy gets a second ticker mention as he checks in with the following European Volleyball news: This weekend the Confederation of European Volleyball (CEV) had qualifying for the 2011 European Championships. Spain’s men’s team has a player with G-Torres, abbreviated for Garcia-Torres; Israel’s men’s team wore a reversed Israeli flag, but back to normal Sunday; The Czech Republic women with vertical arched lettering; The Swedish women have a Swedish flag pattern on their side panel and shorts. … Stephen Wong notes that the Daily Mail is conducting a “Top 50” Kit Countdown, beginning with Kits 50-41. … The French Open may not be tops of everyone’s list of “Must See” but Jonathan Ratshin notes that Venus is sure giving the Parisians something to talk about. … And just moments after I recieved that communiqué, Brinke provided us with more evidence of Venus’ taste in fashion … John Donovan found some awesomely cool ads from a book he has on 1960s advertising. The first is a 1969 NFL ad (looks very Yellow Submarine-ish, no?) and the second is a 1964 Seven-Up Curling ad.
You know we just don’t recognize the most significant moments of our lives while they’re happening. Back then I thought, well, there’ll be other days. I didn’t realize that that was the only day. — Dr. Archibald “Moonlight” Graham
First of all, bravo to Dave Battafarano for his throwback design. Those uniforms look cool.
My dad took my brother and I to Jarry Park in 1975. We banged our feet along with the hometown fans on those aluminium bleachers whenever there was an Expos rally. My little brother came back from that trip an Expos fan, complete with a satin Expos jacket that he’d wear to Phillies games at the Vet. I’m going to see him tonight for his birthday, and now I’m kicking myself for yet another year that has passed with me forgetting to track down a new Expos cap for him. There’s still a little time!
The Cubs announcers used “askew” to describe Soto’s helmet logo as well. Bob Brenley went on to say that Soto was just trying to keep the luck inside the C by turning it up a bit…like a horse shoe.
Don’t you mean Jarry Park never hosted a postseason game? In baseball language, a playoff game is what the Tigers and Twins played last year to decide the AL Central.
In the picture, Johnny Bench is sitting along the left field line of the old Al Lopez field, where the Reds trained until 1987. See this old 1987 topo map. link|Tampa|FL| That is indeed the old Tampa Stadium (the old “Sombrero” ) in the background, it was enclosed in 1975 when the Bucs were preparing to move in (and the U. of Tampa football team was moving out). link
The spot where he is squatting is approximately where the Pirate Ship now stands in the present Raymond James Stadium.
Exhibition Stadium. As nice as the SkyDome (Rogers Centre) is, the Old “Ex” had a warmth, a feel that the ‘Dome can never match. I saw my first game at the Ex on April 10, 1977, Easter Sunday, as Jerry Garvin beat the White Sox. I also saw the next day’s win over the Tigers. I left those ’77 Blue Jays in 1st place in the A.L. East. Then the roof caved in. Living only 175 miles from “TO” (Toronto) and with ticket prices cheap ($7 CDN for a “Field Level Chair”) it was an inexpensive weekend getaway that I did a lot in those days. I saw Blue Jay games when it snowed and Argo footbal games in 90 degree heat. I also attended the 1981 NASL Soccer Bowl between the Cosmos and Chicago Sting. I remember during the Jays first year people attending the ball game had to also buy a ticket to the Canadian Nation Exhibition (Canada’s National Fair) in order to get on the grounds. Back then it cost more to go to the fair than it did for the ball game. So after many complaints the Jays and the Ex worked out a deal. Buy your baseball tickets in advance, show them at the Ex gate and be admitted free. Problem solved. Another quirk of baseball at the fairgrounds.
Exhibition Stadium may have lacked all of the bells and whistles of the ‘Dome but somehow it was a better and more enjoyable experience. It was home and I for one, miss it. Sniff.
My first MLB game was at the Ex. It was the coolest thing ever!
Happy May 2-4 to all the Canucks up there.
I saw the Blue Jays beat the Yankees at Exhibition Stadium many years ago. If I recall correctly the number of seats between aisles was enormous, so going for a beer was a problem for many. Team rosters were on a narrow strip of paper.
In all parks the sun sets behind home plate, but here the sun set in left field.
Terrific effort, gentlemen. Very well done. I love reading about the quirky ballparks of yesteryear … even if yesteryear is only 25-35 years ago!
Great stuff.
Also of note about Exhibition Stadium – the old Hockey Hall of Fame (and Canadian Sports Hall of Fame) were across the street from the roofed grandstand.
[quote comment=”391411″]
In all parks the sun sets behind home plate, but here the sun set in left field.[/quote]
That’s really strange – did Exhibition Stadium batters have problems with the setting sun, or did that grandstand block it?
In any case, your statement is not link. In most parks, it does, but not for all. Enron Field appears to have a similar orientation, with west being in the far left corner of the outfield.
In Milwaukee, the sun sets over first base!
Great read today. Loved Jarry Park and the Expos. Such a contemporary nickname and revolutionary cap juxtaposed with that endearingly modest, tacked together ballpark.
I loved Exhibition Stadium. The bleachers were miles away from the action, and if you sat down the right field line, you ended up with a sore neck, because the aluminum benches were set at a right angle to the field, and you had to turn to your left to watch the game. But there was always a breeze blowing in from the Lake, and there were roller coasters outside the stadium (not to mention the Hockey Hall of Fame), and it was always a lot of fun.
When I was 13, my parents would drop me off at the Buffalo bus depot on Saturday mornings, and I’d buy a round-trip ticket to Toronto. The bus station in Toronto was in Chinatown, several miles from the Ex. I’d take a streetcar and a couple of buses, buy a ticket (50 cents for the general admission seats), and watch a game, then head home. A 12 hour, two hundred mile round trip, crossing an international border, traversing one of the largest cities in North America, all on my own, or with only one of my younger brothers as a traveling companion.
These days, my kids are more cloistered than a Chinese emperor…
[quote comment=”391414″][quote comment=”391411″]
In all parks the sun sets behind home plate, but here the sun set in left field.[/quote]
That’s really strange – did Exhibition Stadium batters have problems with the setting sun, or did that grandstand block it?
In any case, your statement is not link.
In most parks, it does, but not for all. Enron Field appears to have a similar orientation, with west being in the far left corner of the outfield.
In Milwaukee, the sun sets over first base![/quote]
link have the same orientation as Miller Park.
A comment on yesterday’s blog. You included the Yankees in “red alternate jersey” list. I get the tone of the writing..obviously the Yankee logo has more red than blue. But if/when the “unimagineable” day comes that Yankees try that silly marketing trick of a 3rd Jersey in an actual game, I can bet my life that it will not be red!!!!!!!!!!
love the ballpark talk. THX guys.
This is my fav website for such things…
link
Orientation of all home plates:
link
Secondly regarding the Expos:
“…The team had promised (as part of its expansion bid) that a new stadium would be ready by 1972…” yet is says they played there til ’76. What happened?
[quote comment=”391420″]Orientation of all home plates:
link
Secondly regarding the Expos:
“…The team had promised (as part of its expansion bid) that a new stadium would be ready by 1972…” yet is says they played there til ’76. What happened?[/quote]
As far as I can tell, once the team started playing the pressure was off and the new stadium got wrapped up in the Olympic bid.
[quote comment=”391420″]
Secondly regarding the Expos:
“…The team had promised (as part of its expansion bid) that a new stadium would be ready by 1972…” yet is says they played there til ’76. What happened?[/quote]
short answer?
labor strikes, cost overruns and construction delays…
mike or someone more familiar with the situation could probably fill in the details
Thanks for the kind words everyone. This was a fun one to write.
There are so many things that could have been written about the Ex that I left out for length. The right field metal benches, the rock-hard turf, the alcohol ban (no beer for the first six years), but I probably should have written something about Winfield and the seagull.
link
link
[quote comment=”391420″]Orientation of all home plates:
link
Secondly regarding the Expos:
“…The team had promised (as part of its expansion bid) that a new stadium would be ready by 1972…” yet is says they played there til ’76. What happened?[/quote]
Stadium kinda got folded into the whole ’76 Olympics- construction thing, didn’t it? Financially and otherwise. A lot of Olympics-related issues got a little sideways in the aftermath of Munich. Many things got adjusted, timetables included.
I’m sure someone will fill in the precise details.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391418″]A comment on yesterday’s blog. You included the Yankees in “red alternate jersey” list. I get the tone of the writing..obviously the Yankee logo has more red than blue. But if/when the “unimagineable” day comes that Yankees try that silly marketing trick of a 3rd Jersey in an actual game, I can bet my life that it will not be red!!!!!!!!!![/quote]
Nothing silly or wrong about the Yankees trying a third jersey or uniform, New York had several uniform styles before 1936, including monochrome.
I agree, a red jersey would be a bad idea. Instead, the alternate uniform could be white and pinstripe free, with Yankees in red script across the chest. The bat and star spangled hat between the lettering, just like the logo, minus the ball design. On the left sleeve would be the interlocking NY. The hat would remain the same, we have plenty of red and blue hats already.
And there you have it, a tasteful, dignified, alternate uniform true to the identity of the franchise. No solid color top, frontal numbering, and the addition of red and blue on the white jersey would not offend anyone. I think it would also do well in merchandise sales.
Really nice piece today, guys. Tremendous info and images.
The quirkiness and charm of old ballparks (even if only 30 years ago) is a huge part of the quirkiness and charm of baseball. And no sport has it to the degree baseball has.
There are plenty of storied facilities in football, basketball and hockey, but a “sense of place” is almost endemic to baseball.
On one end, wonderful new venues like Target Field; on the other, a chain link fence defines a suburban diamond dappled in puffy dandelions waiting for the wind.
link
It’s really cool to stand somewhere and think, as the song says, “There used to be a ballpark right here.” Gives that chunk of land a certain nobility, I think.
—Ricko
The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
link
I thought if they Yanks were to EVER try a 3rd uniform…not just jersey, but uniform, they might try to drop the pinstripes and just wear the YANKEES in script across the chest and include the LOGO on the sleeve. That would probably be tasteful enough, but I don’t think it will ever happen. The organization is too conservative and will probably allow facial hair before they go that route.
[quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.
Wonderful post, gentlemen.
As Ricko said, there’s something about the quirkiness of the old ballparks. When you’re sharing a stadium with football, soccer, etc., it’s understandable and yeah, a little charming, to have to look to your left or right to watch a game.
With today’s baseball-only parks, though, it’s inexcusable.
What is it with having the seats along the baselines facing the outfield? Most of the action happens in the infield, why not face that way? At least towards second base, huh?
Anyway, I have more memories of the Ex from watching the CFL on ESPN in the early 80s. Speaking of the CFL, that Grey Cup picture link is just splendid. Love those end zones and the numbers marked every five yards.
I looooooove the picture of Exhibition stadium from the second link.
If you look closely, there’s a motorcycle jump set up from end to end on the field. Bonus points if a anyone can find out who the jumper is!
[quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.
The reason why the Expos did not move in 1976 to the Olympic stadium was from July 17th-August 1st.
With two months left in the season, there would be a great deal of work done to get the stadium into baseball shape from the track and field setup.
In Atlanta, the Braves played at Fulton County in 1996, while the Olympic Stadium was converted into Turner Field for opening in 1997.
Thanks for posting this again in the ticker:
link
If anyone knows who the artist might be, please don’t hesitate to reply. I can buy these yearbooks now, however they are a little pricey. Guess I could email the seller, hmmmmm?
Unrelated to todays topic, but Springfield High School, just outside of Toledo, Ohio is facing a petition for a name change. A parent says Blue Devils does not reflect the district’s policies and motto, and carries satanic overtones. She is currently forming a petition that she will take in front of the school board.
See the article here: link
for those curious, the school was established in 1898, but was then called the Zippers. The name switched to Blue Devils in 1959 when Springfield merged w/ Holland Schools.
Regarding the smokestacks read, my favorite smokestacks(non-working) are at the Baltimore Inner Harbor: link
Thanks for sharing those great memories about Exhibitaion Stadium! Sheesh…takes me back to the time we had our high school football championships on the same field where the Argos and Jays played.
That North Grandstand used to be terrible for concerts! Sound would roll up from the stage and get caught under the roof and echo back over the folks sitting there. A couple of bad experiences (The Guess Who and Simon and Garfunkel), and I was sure to get floors for other concerts I saw there (Supertramp, Genesis).
My son’s high school mascots are also the Blue Devils ( Mooresville NC ). It is a nod the Duke Blue Devils. This is definitely the bible belt down here, but no one has ever made such an ignorant complaint!!
[quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.
Anyone know when the Yankees officially red as a team color? Has it been so for a long while?
The reason I ask is because I never thought the hat in the Yankees logo was there to have red be construed as a team color, nor did it even MAKE it a team color. That’s just using Uncle Sam’s hat as a graphic representation of “Yankee”. I mean, had they done it navy and white, it wouldn’t have been an Uncle Sam hat.
By that rationale, flesh tones have to be a Celtics color because the Leprechaun has skin.
The sun is yellow on the Rays’ chests. A team can do that and still have team colors be navy and powder. That sun graphic doesn’t make, or require, yellow to be a Tampa Bay color. It’s just a graphic.
The Timberwolves logo is a wolf, partially drawn in gray. With yellow eyes. Doesn’t mean those are among the team colors.
The original Blue Jays logo had a red maple leaf in the background. Does that mean they initially intended red to be a team color? Doubt it, it was a helluva long time before red showed up anywhere other than in the logo on the uniform.
If Alabama whips up a full color it’s logo and makes the elephant gray…it would do NOTHING to change the school’s colors or uniforms. Directly or indirectly. It would just be the elephant in the color version of that logo.
How ’bout all those colors in the Blackhawks’ crest?
There can be a logo (sometimes with graphic representations of elements of it) and there can be team colors. Doesn’t have to be absolute replication of the former in the latter. Or vice versa.
Y’know, unless someone has another “rule” saying they should be, of course.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391436″]Unrelated to todays topic, but Springfield High School, just outside of Toledo, Ohio is facing a petition for a name change. A parent says Blue Devils does not reflect the district’s policies and motto, and carries satanic overtones. She is currently forming a petition that she will take in front of the school board.
See the article here: link
for those curious, the school was established in 1898, but was then called the Zippers. The name switched to Blue Devils in 1959 when Springfield merged w/ Holland Schools.[/quote]
Devils and clowns freak me out, so it wouldn’t bother me if all teams with devil mascots changed their names.
Thought I’d be OK with the Casper Ghosts, but their mascot looks like a cross between a clown and devil:
link
I like the original name Zippers. That’s what the Akron Zips used to be called. They were named after the rubber zipper boot (Akron being the rubber city, after all), but when they started putting zippers on pants they shortened the nickname.
[quote comment=”391440″][quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.[/quote]
I wonder if there will be repercussions involving the NBA and NHL. The NHL uniforms in particular cry out for different designs.
[quote comment=”391440″][quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.[/quote]
Well, American Needle didn’t ‘win’ anything. It re-acquired the right to sue the NFL. The Chicago Court of Appeals originally threw out the lawsuit, and the Supreme Court reinstated it. There is no verdict as of yet on whether or not the NFL is in violation of the U.S. Antitrust Code. If it is, then isn’t the NBA in violation as well, since it has a similarly exclusive deal with adidas? Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits? I don’t understand why MLB can operate as a single entity divided into 30 ‘teams’, but the NFL is now seen as 32 separate entities. Seems like this might set a strange precedent that contradicts the precedent that’s already been set by MLB, no?
You can poll 1,000 Yankee or baseball fans for that matter, and you would be hard pressed to find anyone that says Red is a Yankee Team color. 100% will say Blue ( and white )…the Uncle Sam logo is a depiction of the American Flag, so it will obviously contain Red. But I do not believe that would make it a team color, much less should it or will be included in the team uniform. In particular a uniform that has basically ( with the exception of modernization ) remained unchanged for almost 80 years.
[quote comment=”391444″][quote comment=”391440″][quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.[/quote]
Well, American Needle didn’t ‘win’ anything. It re-acquired the right to sue the NFL. The Chicago Court of Appeals originally threw out the lawsuit, and the Supreme Court reinstated it. There is no verdict as of yet on whether or not the NFL is in violation of the U.S. Antitrust Code. If it is, then isn’t the NBA in violation as well, since it has a similarly exclusive deal with adidas? Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits? I don’t understand why MLB can operate as a single entity divided into 30 ‘teams’, but the NFL is now seen as 32 separate entities. Seems like this might set a strange precedent that contradicts the precedent that’s already been set by MLB, no?[/quote]
link
Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391441″]Anyone know when the Yankees officially red as a team color? Has it been so for a long while?
The reason I ask is because I never thought the hat in the Yankees logo was there to have red be construed as a team color, nor did it even MAKE it a team color. That’s just using Uncle Sam’s hat as a graphic representation of “Yankee”. I mean, had they done it navy and white, it wouldn’t have been an Uncle Sam hat.
By that rationale, flesh tones have to be a Celtics color because the Leprechaun has skin.
The sun is yellow on the Rays’ chests. A team can do that and still have team colors be navy and powder. That sun graphic doesn’t make, or require, yellow to be a Tampa Bay color. It’s just a graphic.
The Timberwolves logo is a wolf, partially drawn in gray. With yellow eyes. Doesn’t mean those are among the team colors.
The original Blue Jays logo had a red maple leaf in the background. Does that mean they initially intended red to be a team color? Doubt it, it was a helluva long time before red showed up anywhere other than in the logo on the uniform.
If Alabama whips up a full color it’s logo and makes the elephant gray…it would do NOTHING to change the school’s colors or uniforms. Directly or indirectly. It would just be the elephant in the color version of that logo.
How ’bout all those colors in the Blackhawks’ crest?
There can be a logo (sometimes with graphic representations of elements of it) and there can be team colors. Doesn’t have to be absolute replication of the former in the latter. Or vice versa.
Y’know, unless someone has another “rule” saying they should be, of course.
—Ricko[/quote]
I wouldn’t put the Yankees’ red in the same category as the Blackhawks’ flesh tone (or that of the Braves, for that matter).
While the Yankees never made it a part of the uniform, they have used red link over the years, well before the advent merchandising. I’d say that qualifies it as a team color, albeit a secondary one.
[quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
Actually I think the Seahawks have set the precedent that simply having the color in your logo does make it a color worthy of being worn as an alt jersey.
[quote comment=”391444″][quote comment=”391440″][quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.[/quote]
Well, American Needle didn’t ‘win’ anything. It re-acquired the right to sue the NFL. The Chicago Court of Appeals originally threw out the lawsuit, and the Supreme Court reinstated it. There is no verdict as of yet on whether or not the NFL is in violation of the U.S. Antitrust Code. If it is, then isn’t the NBA in violation as well, since it has a similarly exclusive deal with adidas? Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits? I don’t understand why MLB can operate as a single entity divided into 30 ‘teams’, but the NFL is now seen as 32 separate entities. Seems like this might set a strange precedent that contradicts the precedent that’s already been set by MLB, no?[/quote]
Exactly.
The only issue that’s been decided is whether the NFL and its teams are capable of being sued for antitrust on this issue. The answer is “yes”. Now they have a trial on whether the NFL teams actually colluded, and if they did, what American Needle’s remedy is. We’re a long way (years) from any sort of actual resolution.
Final post on the Memorial Cup:
Windsor beat the host Brandon 9-1 yesterday to win their second straight Memorial Cup.
link
Windsor is a heck of a team. They were undefeated in the round robin and every game except for one OT win at this tournament was one-sided.
Do birds perched on a yellow bat make yellow a St. Louis Cardinals team color?
Most likely the change from a black bat to yellow was just to brighten things up a little…and also because not many black bats were around in the late ’40s, early ’50s…not because they intended to add yellow as a potential uni garment color.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391448″]While the Yankees never made it a part of the uniform, they have used red link over the years, well before the advent merchandising. I’d say that qualifies it as a team color, albeit a secondary one.[/quote]
link?
(OK, they were still the Highlanders at the time.)
What’s the deal with that curved end zone in the Grey Cup overhead picture?
[quote comment=”391452″]Do birds perched on a yellow bat make yellow a St. Louis Cardinals team color?
Most likely the change from a black bat to yellow was just to brighten things up a little…and also because not many black bats were around in the late ’40s, early ’50s…not because they intended to add yellow as a potential uni garment color.
—Ricko[/quote]
I think this blog needs to settle this whole team color issue. Paul has all the ESPN connections and stuff… I think he needs to contact every major pro sports team and ask them exactly what colors they consider to be their Team Colors. Then we can know for sure if a a yellow bat or a blue hypocycloid actually counts or not.
[quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
I think the name “Gators” may make green a valid alt jersey color. Have not a number of people used the “well, Ravens are black” justification?
[quote comment=”391437″]Regarding the smokestacks read, my favorite smokestacks(non-working) are at the Baltimore Inner Harbor: link
pittsburgh has a nice row of ’em too at a big shopping/entertainment center:
seen here:
link
and here:
link
[quote comment=”391456″][quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
I think the name “Gators” may make green a valid alt jersey color. Have not a number of people used the “well, Ravens are black” justification?[/quote]
Hey, if it works for link, why not?
Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits?
link
[quote comment=”391444″][quote comment=”391440″][quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.[/quote]
Well, American Needle didn’t ‘win’ anything. It re-acquired the right to sue the NFL. The Chicago Court of Appeals originally threw out the lawsuit, and the Supreme Court reinstated it. There is no verdict as of yet on whether or not the NFL is in violation of the U.S. Antitrust Code. If it is, then isn’t the NBA in violation as well, since it has a similarly exclusive deal with adidas? Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits? I don’t understand why MLB can operate as a single entity divided into 30 ‘teams’, but the NFL is now seen as 32 separate entities. Seems like this might set a strange precedent that contradicts the precedent that’s already been set by MLB, no?[/quote]
MLB recieves a special Congressional exemption to anti-trust legislation. I can’t provide specifics, but for some reason Congress has granted them protection from the Sherman Anti-Trust Act. Occasionally you’ll see Congress talk about taking it away when they’re dealing with steroids.
What’s the deal with that curved end zone in the Grey Cup overhead picture?
An athletics track is in place at the Ex at that time (1972, the year of the 70th Grey Cup). Accordingly, they curve the end zones to fit inside the track. A similar setup was used when the Edmonton Eskimos moved into Commonwealth Stadium (which had an athletics track for the Commonwealth Games).
[quote comment=”391456″][quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
I think the name “Gators” may make green a valid alt jersey color. Have not a number of people used the “well, Ravens are black” justification?[/quote]
Florida’s colors are blue and orange.
Ravens’ colors include black, have since the beginning.
So not even close to the same point.
Colors are not always about the nickname, people. Sometimes they’re all about the PLACE.
Seen a lot of aqua and orange dolphins, have we? No. The colors were selected to call to mind, to symbolize, Miami. Lotta royal and kelly ospreys flying around Seattle?
Are we to believe the early attendees at the U of Florida were so stupid they thought alligators were orange and blue?
We really have to over this notion that colors are all about the nickname, and that any colors used artistically to convey an image in a logo makes those colors are automatically, or appropriately, “Team Colors”.
There are “color used” and there are “team colors”. The problem is that for the sake of thoroughness leagues/teams now list all “colors used” on the unis simply as Team Colors. So the Cardinals’ yellow gets included. Probably the Ray’s sunburst does, too.
Even though anyone who has paid any attention at all knows the Cardinals colors have been–in use, if not on paper–red and navy since before World War II.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391450″][quote comment=”391444″][quote comment=”391440″][quote comment=”391433″][quote comment=”391430″][quote comment=”391427″]The Supreme Court sided with American Needle in their antitrust claims against the NFL.
link
Heh I remember when Jerry signed his own deal with Nike after Apex was bought by Converse. It hit the fan that day.
Holy shit – that’s huge.
And not just because we’ll be seeing a higher quality of NFL cap in the near future.[/quote]
I can’t wait to see which team is the first to opt out of the Reebok contract, and go out on their own.
My money is on the Cowboys.[/quote]
I wouldn’t be surprised if Jerry Jones wasn’t on the phone to Nike as soon as the news hit the wires.[/quote]
Well, American Needle didn’t ‘win’ anything. It re-acquired the right to sue the NFL. The Chicago Court of Appeals originally threw out the lawsuit, and the Supreme Court reinstated it. There is no verdict as of yet on whether or not the NFL is in violation of the U.S. Antitrust Code. If it is, then isn’t the NBA in violation as well, since it has a similarly exclusive deal with adidas? Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits? I don’t understand why MLB can operate as a single entity divided into 30 ‘teams’, but the NFL is now seen as 32 separate entities. Seems like this might set a strange precedent that contradicts the precedent that’s already been set by MLB, no?[/quote]
Exactly.
The only issue that’s been decided is whether the NFL and its teams are capable of being sued for antitrust on this issue. The answer is “yes”. Now they have a trial on whether the NFL teams actually colluded, and if they did, what American Needle’s remedy is. We’re a long way (years) from any sort of actual resolution.[/quote]
[quote comment=”391439″]My son’s high school mascots are also the Blue Devils ( Mooresville NC ). It is a nod the Duke Blue Devils. This is definitely the bible belt down here, but no one has ever made such an ignorant complaint!![/quote]
The school I teach at just decided to change the mascot from Steamers (logo was a steam powered paddle boat) because they didnt feel that students nowadays relate to steamboats. The school is located roughly 6 miles from the Ohio River across from Louisville.
Raiders beat out Blue Devils per student vote. I guess students can relate to bandits and fictional demons moreso than an actual field trip destination such as the Belle Of Louisville.
This Yankee/red debate is silly. If it wasn’t an official color, why would the MLB logo on all their OFFICIAL caps include it (up until last year.)
And it’s used on more than just the Uncle Sam hat, the OFFICIAL wordmark is in red script.
Does this mean they should were a red jersey? No, that would be stupid. But denying the OFFICIAL facts is just as dumb.
[quote comment=”391464″][quote comment=”391439″]My son’s high school mascots are also the Blue Devils ( Mooresville NC ). It is a nod the Duke Blue Devils. This is definitely the bible belt down here, but no one has ever made such an ignorant complaint!![/quote]
The school I teach at just decided to change the mascot from Steamers (logo was a steam powered paddle boat) because they didnt feel that students nowadays relate to steamboats. The school is located roughly 6 miles from the Ohio River across from Louisville.
Raiders beat out Blue Devils per student vote. I guess students can relate to bandits and fictional demons moreso than an actual field trip destination such as the Belle Of Louisville.[/quote]
Maybe something contemporary and powerful?
The Tasers.
That, kids today would identify with, I think.
“Zap ’em, Zap ’em,
Zap ’em til they twitch!
Gooooo….TASERS!!!”
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391457″][quote comment=”391437″]Regarding the smokestacks read, my favorite smokestacks(non-working) are at the Baltimore Inner Harbor: link
pittsburgh has a nice row of ’em too at a big shopping/entertainment center:
seen here:
link
and here:
link
If I could design a stadium, I would incorporate a column of smokestacks to give it that steam punk look. Maybe, something that spewed euphoric smoke vapor, nothing toxic. :o)
[quote comment=”391465″]This Yankee/red debate is silly. If it wasn’t an official color, why would the MLB logo on all their OFFICIAL caps include it (up until last year.)
And it’s used on more than just the Uncle Sam hat, the OFFICIAL wordmark is in red script.
Does this mean they should were a red jersey? No, that would be stupid. But denying the OFFICIAL facts is just as dumb.[/quote]
Who denied it was official? Not me. I just asked WHEN the Yankees began listing an official team color.
All I implied was that it may have evolved from being necessary use on an Uncle Sam hat as a graphic to convey “Yankee”…rather than as intending to use any red in the team’s uniform.
Like the Notre Dame leprechaun posted above. Notre Dame could very easily, if they chose to do so, adhere strictly to navy and gold, saying that the the figure’s green attire is just for purposes of conveying “leprechaun/Irish”. That’s all I meant, that inclusion in the logo does not automatically make a color a team color, nor require it to be considered a team color.
Same for the Florida gator.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391411″]I saw the Blue Jays beat the Yankees at Exhibition Stadium many years ago. If I recall correctly the number of seats between aisles was enormous, so going for a beer was a problem for many. Team rosters were on a narrow strip of paper.
In all parks the sun sets behind home plate, but here the sun set in left field.[/quote]
Hey Joe, I saw many, many games at Exhibition Stadium and the sun was always behind home plate on the third-base side. If you sant in the football grandstand then you’d be in the sun field.
link. Good Onion article on Sharks Logo
[quote comment=”391467″][quote comment=”391457″][quote comment=”391437″]Regarding the smokestacks read, my favorite smokestacks(non-working) are at the Baltimore Inner Harbor: link
pittsburgh has a nice row of ’em too at a big shopping/entertainment center:
seen here:
link
and here:
link
If I could design a stadium, I would incorporate a column of smokestacks to give it that steam punk look. Maybe, something that spewed euphoric smoke vapor, nothing toxic. :o)[/quote]
i remember early sketches for heinz field (even before heinz bought the naming rights), had fake molten metal containers set up that would tip over and sparks and fake molten steel would pour out, or something of that effect, in the open (south) end zone. pretty neat idea, but that one in particular was probably a bit too cartoony for football…
[quote comment=”391449″][quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
Actually I think the Seahawks have set the precedent that simply having the color in your logo does make it a color worthy of being worn as an alt jersey.[/quote]
Yep!
Now how about throw us fans a bone Seahawks FO and bring back some silver/gray? It’s on our link, and it’s so entrenched in the history of the team. Silver/gray alt jersey/pants could be spectacular. Ditch the white pants and go with a Giants type matte gray, would be awesome.
[quote comment=”391471″][quote comment=”391467″][quote comment=”391457″][quote comment=”391437″]Regarding the smokestacks read, my favorite smokestacks(non-working) are at the Baltimore Inner Harbor: link
pittsburgh has a nice row of ’em too at a big shopping/entertainment center:
seen here:
link
and here:
link
If I could design a stadium, I would incorporate a column of smokestacks to give it that steam punk look. Maybe, something that spewed euphoric smoke vapor, nothing toxic. :o)[/quote]
i remember early sketches for heinz field (even before heinz bought the naming rights), had fake molten metal containers set up that would tip over and sparks and fake molten steel would pour out, or something of that effect, in the open (south) end zone. pretty neat idea, but that one in particular was probably a bit too cartoony for football…[/quote]
Yea, that’s pretty close to what the Bucs got going on down at their “theme park”/ Stadium.
[quote comment=”391468″][quote comment=”391465″]This Yankee/red debate is silly. If it wasn’t an official color, why would the MLB logo on all their OFFICIAL caps include it (up until last year.)
And it’s used on more than just the Uncle Sam hat, the OFFICIAL wordmark is in red script.
Does this mean they should were a red jersey? No, that would be stupid. But denying the OFFICIAL facts is just as dumb.[/quote]
Who denied it was official? Not me. I just asked WHEN the Yankees began listing an official team color.
All I implied was that it may have evolved from being necessary use on an Uncle Sam hat as a graphic to convey “Yankee”…rather than as intending to use any red in the team’s uniform.
Like the Notre Dame leprechaun posted above. Notre Dame could very easily, if they chose to do so, adhere strictly to navy and gold, saying that the the figure’s green attire is just for purposes of conveying “leprechaun/Irish”. That’s all I meant, that inclusion in the logo does not automatically make a color a team color, nor require it to be considered a team color.
Same for the Florida gator.
—Ricko[/quote]
But it’s not just included in their logo:
It was on the sox in 1909.
Creamer’s site has the script/ball/hat logo dated 1936.
That Joe D shot is from 1951.
The navy/red mlb logo appeared in the early 90s.
[quote comment=”391471″][quote comment=”391467″][quote comment=”391457″][quote comment=”391437″]Regarding the smokestacks read, my favorite smokestacks(non-working) are at the Baltimore Inner Harbor: link
pittsburgh has a nice row of ’em too at a big shopping/entertainment center:
seen here:
link
and here:
link
If I could design a stadium, I would incorporate a column of smokestacks to give it that steam punk look. Maybe, something that spewed euphoric smoke vapor, nothing toxic. :o)[/quote]
i remember early sketches for heinz field (even before heinz bought the naming rights), had fake molten metal containers set up that would tip over and sparks and fake molten steel would pour out, or something of that effect, in the open (south) end zone. pretty neat idea, but that one in particular was probably a bit too cartoony for football…[/quote]
Indeed. The ketchup bottles tipping to fill up the “Heinz Red Zone” graphic are far more dignified. ;)
[quote comment=”391416″]I loved Exhibition Stadium. The bleachers were miles away from the action, and if you sat down the right field line, you ended up with a sore neck, because the aluminum benches were set at a right angle to the field, and you had to turn to your left to watch the game. But there was always a breeze blowing in from the Lake, and there were roller coasters outside the stadium (not to mention the Hockey Hall of Fame), and it was always a lot of fun.
When I was 13, my parents would drop me off at the Buffalo bus depot on Saturday mornings, and I’d buy a round-trip ticket to Toronto. The bus station in Toronto was in Chinatown, several miles from the Ex. I’d take a streetcar and a couple of buses, buy a ticket (50 cents for the general admission seats), and watch a game, then head home. A 12 hour, two hundred mile round trip, crossing an international border, traversing one of the largest cities in North America, all on my own, or with only one of my younger brothers as a traveling companion.
These days, my kids are more cloistered than a Chinese emperor…[/quote]
Cort, the Toronto Bus Terminal is at Bay & Dundas right at the start of Chinatown. All you had to take to the ball park was the Dundas Streetcar to Bathurst and then transfer to the Bathurst car to the Ex. No city busses needed. You’re right about the Hockey HOF and the Canadian Sports HOF across the street from the stadium. I used to stay at the old Holiday Inn on Chestnut St. In the late ’70s you could get a room there fore $19.95 CDN a night and we got around a 15% premium on U.S. funds. We used to eat at a great Chinese restaurant right across from the hotel on Dundas-the Sai Woo. Ah, the good old days in Toronto when you could cross the border like nothing and visit there without needing a stimulus loan from the government.
[quote comment=”391459″] Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits?
link
Good article.
Keeping with his original thinking, Charlie O. Finley thought all players should get one-year contracts after the Curt Flood ruling. His thinking was that if all players were eligible for free agency, it’d dilute the market. He was right, but nobody listened.
That said, I still root for the players when they get their big contracts. Nobody complains about the money entertainers get (besides movie contracts, Williams Shatner is said to have gotten $600 million for his Priceline commercials.) And if players don’t get the money, who does? I’m not rooting for David Glass to get it.
The Hartford Colonials of the UFL released their logo: link
[quote comment=”391474″][quote comment=”391468″][quote comment=”391465″]This Yankee/red debate is silly. If it wasn’t an official color, why would the MLB logo on all their OFFICIAL caps include it (up until last year.)
And it’s used on more than just the Uncle Sam hat, the OFFICIAL wordmark is in red script.
Does this mean they should were a red jersey? No, that would be stupid. But denying the OFFICIAL facts is just as dumb.[/quote]
Who denied it was official? Not me. I just asked WHEN the Yankees began listing an official team color.
All I implied was that it may have evolved from being necessary use on an Uncle Sam hat as a graphic to convey “Yankee”…rather than as intending to use any red in the team’s uniform.
Like the Notre Dame leprechaun posted above. Notre Dame could very easily, if they chose to do so, adhere strictly to navy and gold, saying that the the figure’s green attire is just for purposes of conveying “leprechaun/Irish”. That’s all I meant, that inclusion in the logo does not automatically make a color a team color, nor require it to be considered a team color.
Same for the Florida gator.
—Ricko[/quote]
But it’s not just included in their logo:
It was on the sox in 1909.
Creamer’s site has the script/ball/hat logo dated 1936.
That Joe D shot is from 1951.
The navy/red mlb logo appeared in the early 90s.[/quote]
So you’re answering my questions as to the history of its use. Good.
And I never said they SHOULDN’T use it. All I’m saying is that inclusion of a color in a logo doesn’t MAKE that color a team color. Sometimes it’s just an artistic element.
The Wisconsin “W” for example. The black is a necessary design element to create that particular style, that effect. You can’t get that effect worth a damn working only in white on red or red on white. You have to render one of two elements in outline and it just doesn’t yield the same result. So then, as such, black shouldn’t necessarily be deemed a “Team Color”. Unless, of course, the team/school says it is. Otherwise it’s just a graphic element. Same for Bucky Badger drawn in black but wearing a red turtleneck sweater.
Here’s the general point, I guess. Anyone who maintains that yellow is a Team Color of the St. Louis Cardinals because of the bat (or that Florida includes green cuz of the gator) doesn’t get what I’m talking about…and probably never will. They can’t fathom that the graphic representation of a nickname doesn’t have to (and often shouldn’t) 100% interlock with the Team Colors, or the uni design.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391478″]The Hartford Colonials of the UFL released their logo: link
If the Locomotives quickly became the Locos, I guess they’ll be the Colons before long, huh.
Classically non-cluttered design, btw.
(eyeroll)
—Ricko
[quote comment=\”391480\”][quote comment=\”391478\”]The Hartford Colonials of the UFL released their logo: link
If the Locomotives quickly became the Locos, I guess they\’ll be the Colons before long, huh.
Classically non-cluttered design, btw.
(eyeroll)
—Ricko[/quote]
hahahaha
[quote comment=”391480″][quote comment=”391478″]The Hartford Colonials of the UFL released their logo: link
If the Locomotives quickly became the Locos, I guess they’ll be the Colons before long, huh.
Classically non-cluttered design, btw.
(eyeroll)
—Ricko[/quote]
Damn there’s a lot going on there.
I like what they did with the H/eagle though, reminds me of the link. (Which, coincidently the link alude to as well.)
When it comes to sports and official colors, I think there’s a difference between official UNIFORM colors and official CORPORATE colors.
The Chicago White Sox official corporate logo is still the logo from the 1980’s (at least it was very recently.) Blue and red are the corporate colors.
Same with the Yankees. Red, White, and Blue are their corporate colors. But not their uniform colors.
Wow, …clicked on that second Venus Williams link and I haven’t seen that big a can since the Raider’s Tommy Kelly lost his pants in that game against the Broncos last year!
I know the SEC baseball tournament logo is using some perspective for the baseball field. But when it turns home plate into a pentagon, that’s when artistic license needs to step in.
link
Other than that, I really like it. especially the font for “Baseball”
[quote comment=”391466″][quote comment=”391464″][quote comment=”391439″]My son’s high school mascots are also the Blue Devils ( Mooresville NC ). It is a nod the Duke Blue Devils. This is definitely the bible belt down here, but no one has ever made such an ignorant complaint!![/quote]
The school I teach at just decided to change the mascot from Steamers (logo was a steam powered paddle boat) because they didnt feel that students nowadays relate to steamboats. The school is located roughly 6 miles from the Ohio River across from Louisville.
Raiders beat out Blue Devils per student vote. I guess students can relate to bandits and fictional demons moreso than an actual field trip destination such as the Belle Of Louisville.[/quote]
Maybe something contemporary and powerful?
The Tasers.
That, kids today would identify with, I think.
“Zap ’em, Zap ’em,
Zap ’em til they twitch!
Gooooo….TASERS!!!”
—Ricko[/quote]
Hey, why not? The MISL had the LA Lazers back in the 80s, Why not the Tasers (or Tazers)?
I don’t like this move. Steamers is a great name (another MISL name, of course). Plus, what’s next? “Young Pittsburghers can no longer relate to the steel industry, let’s change the Steelers name to the Stealers.” “Young Oaklanders aren’t in as good a shape as their parents were, how about changing the Athletics name to the Gamers?” “Young Philadelphians can’t relate to the Revolutionary War, let’s change the 76ers name to the Red White and Blue Devils.”
Raiders. How original. Boo on your school. Not boo on you, Pru, just your school.
[quote comment=”391478″]The Hartford Colonials of the UFL released their logo: link
HART …. FORD looks strange.
[quote comment=”391477″][quote comment=”391459″] Furthermore, why is MLB exempt from antitrust lawsuits?
link
Good article.
Keeping with his original thinking, Charlie O. Finley thought all players should get one-year contracts after the Curt Flood ruling. His thinking was that if all players were eligible for free agency, it’d dilute the market. He was right, but nobody listened.
That said, I still root for the players when they get their big contracts. Nobody complains about the money entertainers get (besides movie contracts, Williams Shatner is said to have gotten $600 million for his Priceline commercials.) And if players don’t get the money, who does? I’m not rooting for David Glass to get it.[/quote]
How about giving some of the money back to the fans? Then next time I go to a Pirates game I can afford to buy a $7.25 beer instead of laughing and walking away.
One-year contracts might get some of the players to hustle as well. Always in your contract year, so you always want to put up the big numbers.
[quote comment=”391483″]When it comes to sports and official colors, I think there’s a difference between official UNIFORM colors and official CORPORATE colors.
The Chicago White Sox official corporate logo is still the logo from the 1980’s (at least it was very recently.) Blue and red are the corporate colors.
Same with the Yankees. Red, White, and Blue are their corporate colors. But not their uniform colors.[/quote]
Thank you. What’s in the logo sometimes is the “corporate” color scheme. And sometimes that logo may appear on the unis, but that doesn’t make all those colors the team’s uni colors.
There are two different versions of the “shaking hands” Twins logo, one against an arched panel, one set against the state of Minnesota. Each has had a yellow outline, and I really don’t see how anyone could claim that makes yellow a Twins’ Team Color, as we historically define team colors…before they morphed into a full list of PM specs of all colors employed by the organization for all purposes.
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391485″]I know the SEC baseball tournament logo is using some perspective for the baseball field. But when it turns home plate into a pentagon, that’s when artistic license needs to step in.
link
Other than that, I really like it. especially the font for “Baseball”[/quote]
Uh… home plate is a pentagon: “In geometry, a pentagon is any five-sided polygon.”
[quote comment=”391462″][quote comment=”391456″][quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
I think the name “Gators” may make green a valid alt jersey color. Have not a number of people used the “well, Ravens are black” justification?[/quote]
Florida’s colors are blue and orange.
Ravens’ colors include black, have since the beginning.
So not even close to the same point.
Colors are not always about the nickname, people. Sometimes they’re all about the PLACE.
Seen a lot of aqua and orange dolphins, have we? No. The colors were selected to call to mind, to symbolize, Miami. Lotta royal and kelly ospreys flying around Seattle?
Are we to believe the early attendees at the U of Florida were so stupid they thought alligators were orange and blue?
We really have to over this notion that colors are all about the nickname, and that any colors used artistically to convey an image in a logo makes those colors are automatically, or appropriately, “Team Colors”.
There are “color used” and there are “team colors”. The problem is that for the sake of thoroughness leagues/teams now list all “colors used” on the unis simply as Team Colors. So the Cardinals’ yellow gets included. Probably the Ray’s sunburst does, too.
Even though anyone who has paid any attention at all knows the Cardinals colors have been–in use, if not on paper–red and navy since before World War II.
—Ricko[/quote]
I don’t have a dog in this fight … but for the record, I attended a now-defunct private high school in Austin, Texas, whose colors were orange and black — and we were known as the Cardinals.
Admittedly, there are a great many oddities in Texas — not a few of them human — but I doubt there were ever any orange and black cardinals flitting about the cacti and pecan trees.
[quote comment=”391490″][quote comment=”391485″]I know the SEC baseball tournament logo is using some perspective for the baseball field. But when it turns home plate into a pentagon, that’s when artistic license needs to step in.
link
Other than that, I really like it. especially the font for “Baseball”[/quote]
Uh… home plate is a pentagon: “In geometry, a pentagon is any five-sided polygon.”[/quote]
But home plate is never an equilateral polygon, as depicted in the logo.
[quote comment=”391462″][quote comment=”391456″][quote comment=”391447″]Codicil…
Do these…
link
link
…make green a valid color for a Gator Alt jersey?
I think not.
—Ricko[/quote]
I think the name “Gators” may make green a valid alt jersey color. Have not a number of people used the “well, Ravens are black” justification?[/quote]
Florida’s colors are blue and orange.
Ravens’ colors include black, have since the beginning.
So not even close to the same point.
Colors are not always about the nickname, people. Sometimes they’re all about the PLACE.
Seen a lot of aqua and orange dolphins, have we? No. The colors were selected to call to mind, to symbolize, Miami. Lotta royal and kelly ospreys flying around Seattle?
Are we to believe the early attendees at the U of Florida were so stupid they thought alligators were orange and blue?
We really have to over this notion that colors are all about the nickname, and that any colors used artistically to convey an image in a logo makes those colors are automatically, or appropriately, “Team Colors”.
There are “color used” and there are “team colors”. The problem is that for the sake of thoroughness leagues/teams now list all “colors used” on the unis simply as Team Colors. So the Cardinals’ yellow gets included. Probably the Ray’s sunburst does, too.
Even though anyone who has paid any attention at all knows the Cardinals colors have been–in use, if not on paper–red and navy since before World War II.
—Ricko[/quote]
I’m not involved in this controversy, but for the record, I attended a now-defunct private high school in Austin, Texas, whose colors were orange and black — and we were called the Cardinals.
Admittedly, my home state has many oddities —
a not-to-be-ignored portion of them human — but I doubt there were ever any orange and black cardinals flitting about the cacti and tumbleweeds.
[quote comment=”391490″][quote comment=”391485″]I know the SEC baseball tournament logo is using some perspective for the baseball field. But when it turns home plate into a pentagon, that’s when artistic license needs to step in.
link
Other than that, I really like it. especially the font for “Baseball”[/quote]
Uh… home plate is a pentagon: “In geometry, a pentagon is any five-sided polygon.”[/quote]
Huh … whaddya know … thanks to Google, I see you’re right! I, too, thought the sides had to be equal …
In any case, MY point is that home plate can look like that from that angle, as its stretched. Any image will look different when viewed from different angles.
link
I never saw a baseball game in Canada. My brother has been to Montreal and Toronto.
Jarry Park intrigued me though.
link
I did see this from the other day. Was it Michael Princip that posted them? Anyhow the art work on those is awesome.
link
Sweet finds on the auction. But I wonder about the accuracy of this Cal Bears jersey. I wonder the date of it. I have seen the Cal Bears pose in a super cool picture with the striped sleeves. Not sure when they had a number on the front though. Of course teams back then may have worn different jerseys at different times.
If I find that picture I will post it later. Just a matter of where it is.
[quote comment=”391495″][quote comment=”391490″][quote comment=”391485″]I know the SEC baseball tournament logo is using some perspective for the baseball field. But when it turns home plate into a pentagon, that’s when artistic license needs to step in.
link
Other than that, I really like it. especially the font for “Baseball”[/quote]
Uh… home plate is a pentagon: “In geometry, a pentagon is any five-sided polygon.”[/quote]
Huh … whaddya know … thanks to Google, I see you’re right! I, too, thought the sides had to be equal …
In any case, MY point is that home plate can look like that from that angle, as its stretched. Any image will look different when viewed from different angles.
link
No way. If the intent was to show a single-point perspective representation of home plate, then the perspective is way off relative to the rest of the field.
Continue the lines of the supposedly parallel sides out, and they meet well short of the pitcher’s mound in that pic.
[quote comment=”391497″]http://www.illustratednfl.talktalk.net/images/rams_yearbook_covers.jpg
I did see this from the other day. Was it Michael Princip that posted them? Anyhow the art work on those is awesome.[/quote]
Yep, I posted that on Friday. In any case, I’m trying to find out who the artist is. Any idea Larry?
[quote comment=”391500″][quote comment=”391497″]http://www.illustratednfl.talktalk.net/images/rams_yearbook_covers.jpg
I did see this from the other day. Was it Michael Princip that posted them? Anyhow the art work on those is awesome.[/quote]
Yep, I posted that on Friday. In any case, I’m trying to find out who the artist is. Any idea Larry?[/quote]
How about that sweet Rams uniform depicted on that 1958 cover? Love it!
[quote comment=\”391500\”][quote comment=\”391497\”]http://www.illustratednfl.talktalk.net/images/rams_yearbook_covers.jpg
I did see this from the other day. Was it Michael Princip that posted them? Anyhow the art work on those is awesome.[/quote]
Yep, I posted that on Friday. In any case, I\’m trying to find out who the artist is. Any idea Larry?[/quote]
Not sure Michael, but yes I love the look about the work. So cool.
Teams get to declare their own team colors, and they’re usually listed in the league guides. The colors don’t necessarily match the uniforms or the logo. The Yankees team colors could officially be red, white, and blue (I don’t know), but that doesn’t mean they can or should use red on the uniform.
Indeed. The ketchup bottles tipping to fill up the “Heinz Red Zone” graphic are far more dignified. ;)
At least we didn’t get the pirate ship at PNC Park.
I remember reading when Jacobs Field opened that the (narrow) light towers there are supposed to evoke smokestacks.
[quote comment=”391469″][quote comment=”391411″]I saw the Blue Jays beat the Yankees at Exhibition Stadium many years ago. If I recall correctly the number of seats between aisles was enormous, so going for a beer was a problem for many. Team rosters were on a narrow strip of paper.
In all parks the sun sets behind home plate, but here the sun set in left field.[/quote]
Hey Joe, I saw many, many games at Exhibition Stadium and the sun was always behind home plate on the third-base side. If you sant in the football grandstand then you’d be in the sun field.[/quote]
I guess it depends on the time of year. Most of my experiences were at the three old parks in New York, and Fenway Park. The sun usually set between home and third, I believe. Exhibition Stadium was distinctly different, as I recall.
The orientation of Enron Field and Skydome are of interest, but they are domed stadiums. The White Sox, on the other hand, turned the playing field around ninety degrees from that utilized in Comiskey Park.
Yellow Submarine-ish? Naaah. Looks like the legendary Peter Max to me. link
[quote comment=”391507″]Yellow Submarine-ish? Naaah. Looks like the legendary Peter Max to me. link
could very well be — interstingly, a lot of people (mistakenly) thought max did YS… the film’s art director was heinz edelmann…and he, along with his contemporary milton glaser, pioneered the psychedelic style for which max would later become famous
I seem to recall the sun setting between home and third as well at the Ex.
I’ve got a good azimuth calculator and will post something later on where the sun would have set at the Ex, by month. I’ll post the method as well if anyone wants to try it for another park.
[quote comment=”391461″]What’s the deal with that curved end zone in the Grey Cup overhead picture?
An athletics track is in place at the Ex at that time (1972, the year of the 70th Grey Cup). Accordingly, they curve the end zones to fit inside the track. A similar setup was used when the Edmonton Eskimos moved into Commonwealth Stadium (which had an athletics track for the Commonwealth Games).[/quote]
Actually the Eskimos still use the rounded end zone
link
Even the Montreal Alouettes have rounded end zones.
link
There was an old hockey jersey featured here once that depicted smokestacks in the logo. It looked terrific. Anyone remember that?
[quote comment=”391512″]There was an old hockey jersey featured here once that depicted smokestacks in the logo. It looked terrific. Anyone remember that?[/quote]
are you thinking of this one jim?
/beauty, eh?
[quote comment=”391505″]Indeed. The ketchup bottles tipping to fill up the “Heinz Red Zone” graphic are far more dignified. ;)
At least we didn’t get the pirate ship at PNC Park.
I remember reading when Jacobs Field opened that the (narrow) light towers there are supposed to evoke smokestacks.[/quote]
I always thought of toothbrushes.
link
[quote comment=”391513″][quote comment=”391512″]There was an old hockey jersey featured here once that depicted smokestacks in the logo. It looked terrific. Anyone remember that?[/quote]
are you thinking of link jim?
Yeah, that’s it, Phil. Thanks.
That is is beyond wonderful.
/beauty, eh?[/quote]
[quote comment=”391513″][quote comment=”391512″]There was an old hockey jersey featured here once that depicted smokestacks in the logo. It looked terrific. Anyone remember that?[/quote]
are you thinking of link jim?
/beauty, eh?[/quote]
Who knew that team’s nickname was about living with air pollution.
Until I saw the logo here at UW, I’d always thought they were named after the guys who fought forest fires.
—Ricko
I assume most of us have heard about this…
link
—Ricko
[quote comment=”391464″][quote comment=”391439″]My son’s high school mascots are also the Blue Devils ( Mooresville NC ). It is a nod the Duke Blue Devils. This is definitely the bible belt down here, but no one has ever made such an ignorant complaint!![/quote]
The school I teach at just decided to change the mascot from Steamers (logo was a steam powered paddle boat) because they didnt feel that students nowadays relate to steamboats. The school is located roughly 6 miles from the Ohio River across from Louisville.
Raiders beat out Blue Devils per student vote. I guess students can relate to bandits and fictional demons moreso than an actual field trip destination such as the Belle Of Louisville.[/quote]
how terrible and short-sighted. Things like this make me sad